THE GOOD, THE BAD, & THE UGLY
I went to the "goldenhands" of oncologists yesterday. Honestly, I was dreading the appointment because pretty much all appointment of late have resulted in those "WHAA?!!" realizations, and although I've wrapped my mind around the fact that I will definitely be getting chemo, and have even joked about being sick and bald, I hadn't really thought about what exactly that would entail for me over the next six months, other than it couldn't be that much worse than being pregnant, right? (minus the bald thing). In any event, another firehose education with some mixed results.
The Not So Good: Remember that "now I'm cancer free" concept? Again, I was smoking something, according to the "Sedlacek Metastictic Index/SMI" (Sedlacek is the doctor) that uses tumor characteristics to quantify the risk of 10 year metastasis with local therapy alone... (Metastisis means the cancer spreads to the bones/lungs/liver. At this point, they can't do much about it when it gets to that.)
2% risk for each 1mm up to 100mm --> 20%
1.5% risk for each 1mm of tumor from 10 to 35mm --> 30% (Note that I had thought my tumor was around 2cm (20mm), turns out it was more like 3cm, but I still need to clarify this with the surgeon-- how could all of the scans been so far off?)
8% for each lymph node in 1-3LN+ patients --> 8% (remember that negative/positive node thing, turns out I count as positive in at least 1, darn)
adverse pronostic factors:
ER negative (check)
PR negative (check)
HER2/nue positive (I'm negative-- yippee! but double edged sword, they actually have this new miracle drug that treats this really well)
High Ki-67 and/or %S-phase (e.g., aggressive tumor) (check)
Multiple total risk by 2.5X for 3 adverse prognostic factors. 58% x 2.5 = >100%
...if the cumulative risk of metastasis at 10 years is greater that 100% than take 58% of the 10 year risk to determine 5 year risk = 84%
Well, shit.
(Note that I almost NEVER swear, to the point that my mom even offered me money to say the "S Word" at one point, but if there was ever an appropriate time...)
Bottom line: I REALLY REALLY need chemotherapy. According to the doctors index, there is certainly that lurking cell somewhere within me. The good news is that chemo works well and with it will reduce the chance of metastasis by 75% (this is the number he threw out). My immediate translation of that probably-not-so-scientific analysis is that I have a 1 in 4 chance of getting terminal cancer in the next 10 years. There, I said it. Worse fears confirmed.
I repeat-- Well, shit.
As an engineer, my inclination is to latch onto these numbers as something concrete and real. I want to do more research to determine with more confidence (note that although this is a straightforward formula, I have not seen risk quantified like this in any of the other books I've read, which puts it more into the "rule of thumb" rather than "absolute fact" world.) That 75% reduction due to chemo he threw out there plagues me... Where did that come from? Is he overestimating because he's biased? How is success (still don't like "survival rate" terminology) affected by age, health, and a billion other factors? (Not the least of which-- (maybe the most?) is attitude and support network?)
Ultimately though, IT JUST DOESN'T MATTER.
It doesn't matter if it's 99% or 1%. It does me (and everyone else around me) no good to dwell on negative possibilities. All that matters is what I can do. And I will do everything I possibly can-- I will get the most aggressive chemo they can offer me (but that's nothing new, and that's where the good news comes in, see below.) I will amp up the healthy lifestyle-- eat right, and exercise (this step alone will likely benefit my entire family in the long run more than if this never would've happened) and whatever else comes up. I know this all sounds trite, and I can't deny that I'm having a hard time right now... heck, I still can't pick up my kids for goodness sake... but I will get there.
I guess it comes down to the question of would you change anything in your life if you knew you were going to die in the next 10 years?
My initial reactions is-- not really.
Now, how cool is that?!
The Good: Dr. SMI laid out several different chemotherapy paths that are appropriate for someone in my situation. From my appointment with the other oncologist, I "knew" I would need 8 rounds of chemo, likely one dose every 3 weeks (3x8 = 24 weeks = 6 months). What we learned from Dr. SMI is that there is a new "dose dense" method where the 8 rounds are given every 2 weeks. (16 weeks) There is an alternative where a different group of chemicals is given every 3 weeks, but for 6 rounds (18 weeks). More importantly, he said the anti-nausea drugs are such that only 50% of patients get sick, and if I am in the sick half, the first go-round will be the worst as they can change doses so that it gets better every time. Most importantly, I will get this drug called "Neulasta" that will increase my white blood counts enough that I won't have to worry so much about infection-- e.g., we don't have to chose between taking the kids out of daycare and banning them from being around me. He said that I would be sick for only a day or two after each treatment-- That for four months, compared to being miserable sick, and worse, in danger of infection, for 6 months is fantastic! (again, it's all so relative).
The Ugly: I'm definitely going to lose my hair. Probably by mid-March I will be bald. Something that I'd never really thought about before alexander was born was head shape. I have been surprised at how many (and there have been a lot) people have complimented alexander on this quality, as in "my, what a beautifully shaped head he has!" (I did not know this was a cosmetic feature of interest, but hey). I have always maintained that this feature comes from ME, since in every other sense xander is a mini-jim. Now I get to prove it :)
p.s. If you're reading this PLEASE post a comment/send me an email etc. I wasn't kidding about that feedback thing. I need you guys.
21 Comments:
Those "statistics" (whatever they really mean) don't account for YOU and the effect of those who love and support you...and they don't even consider the scope and nature of the medical advances that will occur during the coming years. Just think about what those "statistics" had to say 10 years ago!
PS Both your parents and one of your sisters occasionally use 4-letter words (and not merely the s-word), but YOU?! I think I kind of like it.
I guess I am the sister that never cusses. Obviously, dad hasn't been with me driving in traffic or during a stressful Gator game :)
Like you, I am an optimist, and a big believer in the power of love and support from others. The amount already shown by everyone has been mind-boggling. Chemo contains a lot of strong chemicals, but it has nothing on the force of the cumulative love/support/positive thinking you've received and will continue to receive :)
I love you!
T
I'm with your dad on the cussing--I'm actually kind of turned on... :) :)
I digress. (Can you digress when you haven't progressed to begin with? Maybe I'm in a continual state of digression?)
I digress further.
If the odds of getting struck by lightning or winning the lottery are 500 million to one--do you think the dude with the bolt in his back or the bucks in his pocket really cares what the odds were? You said it yourself--statistics don't give the full picture, they're merely the best way we have to express probability. They have to account for all the extreme cases too. When in your life have you EVER fallen into the middle of a bell curve, seriously?
I only want you to hear that numbers mean nothing without actual evidence and experience, and there is no way to account for that until it happens. You said you want to latch onto these numbers, but you can't, because they may not represent you, no? We all have a relatively high likelihood of having a serious car accident in our lives, yet most of us never do. My case in point.
And I know this is all just a math lecture, and not really all that supportive, sorry for that. But I know that it's also the language you speak fluently and I want to help you see that you can take this with a grain of salt just like you did the 1% per year equals 100% in 100 years bit.
Anyway, I hope you will grace us all with some more sailor talk. Maybe something really colorful next time?
I know of no one in the whole world who will take the fight to cancer's door the way you will. And I believe in my core that your internal attitude and BELIEF in your good outcome is everything, which is why I'm confident that all the statisticians can just swing.
love you,
bmc :)
Statistics and projections are just numbers. You are a person foremost so the stats don't really apply to you. In order to come up with a norm, there has to be 2 sides to the spectrum. I know you will be on the good end of it. Love ya and I am thinking positive.
I made it out of mine just fine and you will too. There just is not another option.
Lorri
P.S. I too like the sailor talk. If the kids can talk in dolphin
you can talk in sailor!!!
Lorri
Once again, I lost the last blog response. Testing,...
Carolyn -
As kids, we could tell if my mom was really mad if she used the "s-word"...she never swears and if one slips out, we knew to head for the apple orchard (literally) until dinner time. I picked up a few choice words myself (having lived life most of my life like Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm) in college. I remember driving my mom and dad to the airport when I was about 20 and someone cut me off. Before I realized it, my head spun around like Sybil and words that only a sailor (on a bad day) could say came out of my mouth. I still remember the look on my dad's face; if my mom had had a bar of lava or ivory in the car, it would have been in my mouth. I'm still cracking up thinking about the event. Alas, if you feel inclined to bring out "the sailor in you", please feel free...I would also suggest you sing loudly in the shower, give yourself a pedicure and paint your nails fire engine red, buy plastic pink flamingos and stick them in your front yard, and do whatever makes you feel good. I realize you and I both spent some time in Norfolk - the motto there (at least when I lived there in 2004) was "celebrate life daily"...I think we should all do this and you need to stop thinking about the math and start thinking about all the fun you can have and get well at the same time. You are a role model, inspiration, and amazing individual - everyone knows this the moment they meet you. We are drawn to you because of these characteristics and it's these things that will get you through your treatment and onto a complete recovery. Have a wonderful Saturday. I'll check in again with you tomorrow.
Your friends in Pasadena
Hey, me again.
Was thinking about you some more (imagine) and what I tried to say in my last post kind of gelled. Attempt #2:
One of my favorite lines from a movie comes from Gattaca. Two brothers live in a time where space travel is a daily occurrence, and genetics are understood at birth, i.e. what problems one will have over the course of their life. The younger brother is diagnosed with a 99% chance of heart failure by age 35 (or something along those lines), so he can't be an astronaut. But he manages to do it anyway (through cleverness and deceit).
He and his brother have a tradition of seeing who can swim out the farthest in the ocean without chickening out and turning back. The older brother is a perfect specimen of humanity and athleticism, but the younger brother beats him in the contest. When the older brother asks how he could possibly have won, he replies, "I didn't save anything for the trip back".
Whether you are given a 1% or 100% chance of recovery, you are going to pull out all the stops and play with everything you have. In that sense, the statistics serve only as a signpost along the way; sometimes helpful, often not.
And I would argue that in your daily life pre-cancer, you have never saved anything for the trip back either. It is the only way to live (free of fear), and it's why you have an automatic advantage over this illness and over others who face it.
talk again soon,
bmc :)
Hi Cari, You WILL beat the odds; of that I am certain!!! My heart is with you and sending you all those warm fuzzies which ward off cancer-repeats!!!! Jewell
I like what Jim says, "it's going to be ok."
This may be one of the toughest moments of all, with all of the statistics to work through. But the outliers are always part of the mix as well, and there is so much about you that is extraordinary. You'll be extraordinary in your success in beating this as well.
So much love here in this place - from you, and for you! Not being as eloquent as you and your family and friends, I'll just remind you of the well-worn quote on Geri's office wall. Anonymous says, "When you're going through hell, keep on going." I'm so thankful to be able to tag along on your challenging journey to perfect health. Nobody can face a challenge any better than you. -a
WHOA, NELLIE! Just to clarify...Cari does not have to "beat the odds." For ANY woman with Cari's combination of risk factors, the chances are apparently 3 in 4 that she will NOT develop a new cancer within 10 years. And, as anyone reading this blog knows, Cari is not just just ANY woman! In fact, by keeping her "eat right and exercise" pledge, she will be healthier than ever, increasing her odds of NOT developing any new cancer to 110%, as I run the numbers. And I am truly excellent at math.
SHIT,F***stick, A**hole, Chicken...
Hi Carolyn,
I have heard you on plenty of occasions drop the 'f' bomb or the 's' word. I am glad that your 'purity' has been shown to the world.
Keep your head up and keep swearing. When I swear in the classroom, my day always goes better. Also, it is always really cute when little kids swear. So when we get home, I will make it my job to teach Xander how to speak 'properly'.
Hang in there. You guys are awesome and are an inspiration to anyone who has to go through difficult times. I love how you are just taking this thing head on and dealing with it as it comes.
Love,
Mike
I love it that you're focusing on what you can do and how you want to live your life. The statistics really don't matter. I personally know someone who's doctor said his chances of surviving his stage 4 cancer 1 year were nil, and he was alive and cancer free 5 years later. His focus was on making his life meaningful and enjoyable.
Hi there,
Well, this is one time I'm just as happy that I really do NOT understand statistics. Reading the comments is helpful for my understanding - especially Dad's Whoa Nellie!
You are such a success story is everything you do. And what focus! This is your challenge now and you (and we) are up for it.
I agree with Mike that it is adorable the way kids cuss. Lucky he will be back to tutor X soon. By the way, isn't Laim still searching for his first clear word? I can think of a few.
Keep writing! You are inspired in your 'voice'. So is Jim, actually. He's just a bit more succinct. Love you, each and every one.
Carolyn,
Just wanted to let you know I read you blog everyday (as religously as I check Get Fuzzy online).
As one who has been in a lab for a few years, remember that the data that those statistics came from is not always "sound." Use them as guides to make medical decisions, but not life decisions. As you said what matters is would you change anything? I envy that you can say no. We are not all as lucky as you.
Be proactive: Shave your head first! Have fun with it! If you need some examples I can send you some of me!
dustin
I think you need a PhD to understand all those numbers... lucky you :) But then, the numbers aren't really all that important, are they? I'd be much more interested in the numbers representing a person's support network (ie warm fuzzy intake) and positive outlook on LIFE. Maybe you should do a study on that? I'd read your book! I've never met a more optimistic person than you, Cari, and I know that with that optimism you will conquer anything and everything that comes your way. Then I will pin a medal on your chest and say "very impressive"...
big hugs,
meg
I think you need a PhD to understand all those numbers... lucky you :) But then, the numbers aren't really all that important, are they? I'd be much more interested in the numbers representing a person's support network (ie warm fuzzy intake) and positive outlook on LIFE. Maybe you should do a study on that? I'd read your book! I've never met a more optimistic person than you, Cari, and I know that with that optimism you will conquer anything and everything that comes your way. Then I will pin a medal on your chest and say "very impressive"...
big hugs,
meg
We like to call him.....MINI Jim....(tapping fingers together).
Carolyn -
Just sit back and glow in the love that you read in this blog! How fantastic that Ben can send so much love from so far away. And the great thing is - like your dad said - you don't have to beat the odds. And here is why - you only have to worry about the odds if you are mixed up in the "rules" of the "game." The game being all the statistics. But with your positive attitude, support from family and friends and the Super Trio at home of Fantab-o-husband, X-man and his little side kick the Amazing Wham-o, you can do something that mere mortals cannot do. Radioactive Boob Woman can CHANGE THE GAME YOU ARE PLAYING. Like you said last night, you can take ownership of every negative idea, statistic, etc. that the doctors throw your way, or you can decide to leave it with them and maintain your positivity. I know this is easier to say than to do, but you have always overachieved, you always find a way to smile and you have the love and support of so many people. So I say - take the game off THEIR board and put it on your board - your own terms, your rules. Remember the mind is a powerful tool and luckily, you use it to do so much good! (If you didn't we'd all be in trouble, due to your amazing radioactive powers!).
You are my inspiration and I love you - sending you lots of happy, positive vibes all week long (esp Tues, Thurs and Friday!!!).
Big hugs, Karlynn
Hi Carolyn
I hadn't checked your blog for a few days. You are a force to reckoned with. While the numbers and statistics are there you are a strong and POSITIVE entity. While the results right now may not be what any of us wanted to hear just KNOW that everyday more is learned and discovered about cancer. You are strong and great - hang in there kiddo!
Love, Colleen
Carolyn,
Even if all of the statistics in the world were stacked up against you (which they're not), you are stronger than any of this. All of the love that your friends and family have shown, all of the strength that you have show, and all of the angels that have blessed you with the two amazing children that you have, your loving family, your great job, your charisma and charm are stronger and more meaningful than any statistic. Stay strong, stay brave and know that you are loved, cared for, admired, and missed.....
--kara
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